Izina Munyakazi Sadate ni rimwe mu amaze kuba kimomo mu Rwanda cyane cyane mu bijyanye na siporo kubera ikipe ya Rayon Sports yihebeye, n’iby’ishoramari kuko ari umwe muri ba rwiyemezamirimo batanga icyizere.
Uyu mugabo yatangiye kumenyekana cyane hagati ya 2019 na 2020 ubwo yayoboraga Rayon Sports, kuva icyo gihe atangira no kuvugwa mu zindi nzego zirimo ishoramari na politike adasiba gutangamo ibitekerezo.
Mu kiganiro yagiranye na IGIHE dukesha iyi nkuru , Munyakazi Sadate yagarutse kuri byinshi byaranze ubuzima bwe haba mu ishoramari, umutungo we, ubuzima bw’umuryango n’ibindi.
IGIHE: Sadate abantu benshi bakumenye muri siporo ariko mpamya ko ari bake bakuzi neza, watunyuriramo gato amateka y’ubuto bwawe?
Navukiye i Nyanza mu Majyepfo mu Murenge wa Busoro, Akagari ka Kimirama, Umudugudu wa Kireranyana. Ni mu giturage, ahantu icyo gihe abantu batagiraga amazi yo mu nzu cyangwa umuriro uyu bacanira ku gikuta. Twavukiye aho mu giturage kirimo inka, urumva ko hari ibyo natwe twarushaga abanyamujyi.
Aho ni na ho nize amashuri abanza, ntangira kuhakinira umupira mu mashuri abanza. Nyuma ya Jenoside yakorewe Abatutsi, navuga ko abantu bagiye babaho badafite aho babarizwa hazwi. Aho mvuka hari hamaze gusenywa no gutwikwa, aho narokokeye mu Ruhango, nahageraga nk’uwaharokokeye.
Navukiye mu muryango w’abarimu kuko ababyeyi banjye ni wo mwuga bakoraga. Bwari ubuzima bw’umukozi wa leta wo mu giturage ubayemo mu buzima busanzwe.
Ubwo buzima bwaje gusenywa na Jenoside yakorewe Abatutsi. Ababyeyi, abavandimwe n’imitungo umuntu arabibura ndetse n’inzu ziratwikwa.
I Kigali nahaje gutyo nta ntego ariko ubuzima burahenyerekeza ndetse mbasha kwiga ndarangiza, nshaka umugore, ngira abana batanu, abana nabyaye hakiri kare kuko nabyaye mfite imyaka 15. Ubu mfite umusore naraga ibyanjye na we agakomerezaho kuko arenda kuzuza imyaka 29, umukurikira na we ari kugana muri 27 gutyo gutyo ku buryo ubu bucura afite imyaka 18.
Wafashe ute icyemezo cyo kwinjira i Kigali, hanyuma mu bihe bya mbere ubuzima bwari bwifashe gute?
Nagize amahirwe nakirwa n’umwe mu miryango i Nyamirambo. Ni umuryango nshimira cyane w’abayisilamu, ari na ho naje kumenyera Isilamu nkaba umuyisilamu. Ni kwa Nyirasenge wa Musa Fazil, Visi Perezida w’Inteko. Ni ho nabaye nyuma ya Jenoside, hariya mu Biryogo.
Abantu bo mu Biryogo hari ukuntu abandi babafata, ariko nababwira ko hariya ari ahantu hari urukundo rudasanzwe, hari abantu bashobora gufashanya, bashobora gutuma wumva ugaruye icyizere cy’ubuzima. Hatuma wumva abagukikije ari barumuna bawe, ari bashiki bawe, abandi ubona ari ababyeyi bawe, ba nyokorome na ba nyogosenge. Ukura wumva ufite umuryango.
Hari abahafata ukundi ariko i Nyamirambo kiriya gice cya Biryogo nakibayemo kandi mbana n’abantu neza batuma nongera kumva icyanga cy’ubuzima, nongera kumva ubuzima bugize icyerekezo.
Wabaye muri ubwo buzima, waje guhinduka umushoramari ate?
Nyuma ya Jenoside rero, umuntu yagombaga kugira ubuzima. Nyuma yo kurokorwa n’Inkotanyi, bahitaga bakubwira bati “Humura ntugipfuye.”
Nyuma y’uko kwitabwaho biri rusange, nari umwana w’imyaka 12, uri kubona inkongoro ziza kurya imirambo y’abe, akabona abantu yizeraga ko ari abantu beza ni bo bishe iwabo cyangwa barabagambaniye.
Amahitamo ni cyo kintu cyari gikomeye cyo gukora kuko ni wa mwana wo kubwirwa ngo jya ku ishuri, ariko uwo munsi arafata icyemezo abyibwire ati nzajya nijyana ku ishuri.
Twagize amahirwe adasanzwe tubona umuntu wo kureberaho. Perezida wa Repubulika Paul Kagame. Icyo gihe yakoze ibikorwa n’ingendo nyinshi akajya atanga imbwirwaruhame zitanga icyizere ku buryo umwana w’imyaka 15 yabaga ashobora guhita abona umuntu wo kumubera icyitegererezo.
Nubwo rero twari tumaze gusenywa ku rugero rubi rushoboka kandi tudafite abagomba kuduha urugero rwiza kuko benshi bari bamaze kwicwa, twagize amahirwe yo kubona uwo tureberaho mwiza.
Njye rero intekerezo zabaga zinyerekeza ku gukora ubushabitsi kuko naribwiraga nti kwihorera kwiza, ni ukubaho ku buryo uwakwishe atazabona ko wapfuye koko.
Naravuze nti ngomba kubiharanira nkora ubucuruzi nkagira amafaranga kuko burya kuba bamwe bita aba-fonctionaires ukazagera aho utunga amafaranga menshi biragora.
Nari nariyemeje ko nzikorera ndetse nkirangiza amashuri yisumbuye nagize amahirwe mpita mbona akazi ko kujya gukora muri Banki y’Abatutrage, ariko iteka ryose nabaga mvuga nti ngomba kuzikorera kugira ngo ngire aho ngera hafatika.
Urwo rugendo rwo kwikorera warutangiriye he?
Mu 2006 mfatanyije n’umugore wanjye tukiri bato, navuga ko ari bwo natangiye kwikorera. Icyo gihe ni bwo twashinze Ikigo cyacu (Company) cyo gukora ibijyanye n’Icapiro (Papéterie) ndetse n’ibyo gutaka (décoration).
Nk’umuntu wakoraga muri banki, nagendaga nsaba inguzanyo nto kugira ngo bya bikorwa byacu na byo bibashe gutera imbere. Icyari kinini icyo gihe si inguzanyo, ahubwo ni igitekerezo n’amahitamo nakoze.
Mu 2008 ni bwo nafashe umwanzuro wo kureka gukorera banki njya gukorera ikigo cyanjye. Naravugaga nti niba mbasha gukorera banki ikunguka, nanjye ninjya kwikorera nzunguka.
Ntabwo byahise bigenda neza nk’uko nabyibwiraga ahubwo nahuye n’ibibazo byinshi n’udufaranga nari nazanye ngo tuzamfasha, turanshirana. Nageze ku rugero rwo hasi rushoboka ku buryo nageze aho ngurisha intebe zo mu nzu n’ibindi byose nashoboraga gutanga nkabona amafaranga.
Guhomba bigeze aho byatewe n’iki?
Buriya kuba imfubyi biragatsindwa. Ushobora gukora amahitamo runaka, ariko kubera kubura abajyanama hari ibyo nagiye njyamo ntekereza ko bizakunda ariko biranga.
Nagiye mu byo gushaka amasoko ya leta kuko icyo gihe navuga ko kimwe n’abandi bose, umukiliya munini twabaga dufite ni leta.
Napiganiye amasoko rero ariko namaze imyaka ibiri hafi itatu ntarabona isoko na rimwe. Ubwo rero urumva icyo gihe cyose cyantwaye amafaranga ashira nyareba ntangira kugurisha imitungo nari mfite kugera no ku bikoresho byo mu nzu.
Naje kongera kubyutsa umutwe kubera kwanga ikintu cyo gucika intege. Ni inkuru ndende ariko Imana ikora ibitangaza.
Twabonye ejo bundi utangaza imisoro wishyuye, bivuze ko waje kwagura ibikorwa, ujya mu bwubatsi, ubu umuntu avuze ko mufite umutungo ubarirwa hagati ya miliyari ebyiri na miliyari eshanu; yaba yibeshye?
Ni byo koko, ikigo cyose iyo gikora, gikora ibaruramari kugira ngo kimenye imitungo gifite cyangwa imikorere uko yagenze. Navuga ko rero mu mwaka ushize wa 2024, ntabwo ari ibanga, iwacu muri Karame Rwanda ntacyo duhisha kuko twabanje gutunganya ahahise hacu n’aho turi uyu munsi, twinjije arenga miliyari 3,5 Frw. Imibare yanyu rero ntabwo yagiye kure y’ukuri.
Si imibare twishimiye cyane twajya kurata ngo ducinye akadiho, ariko ni n’urugendo tubona ko atari rubi ku muntu wahereye ku busa akaba ageze kuri miliyari 3,5 Frw mu mikorere, si ikintu kibi ndetse navuga ko hari umusanzu uba utanze ku gihugu.
Umwaka ushize rero ni ariya mafaranga twinjije ndetse n’uwawubanjirije twari kuri miliyari 2,9 Frw mu gihe uwa 2022 wo twari ku mafaranga nk’ayo.
Icyo mbona rero ni uko tugenda turushaho gutera intambwe kandi bimpa icyizere cy’ejo hazaza.
Aho twitsaga ku kigo cyanyu cy’ubushabitsi; ku giti cyanyu nk’umuntu iyo muri gukora imibare mubona mumaze kugira imitungo ifite agaciro kangana iki?
Mvuze ko ntayizi naba mbeshye. Kubera ko iyo mfite ikibanza ndabarisha nkamenya uko gihagaze, niba ari inzu cyangwa imodoka mba nzi uko bihagaze. Ubu ntitukiri abashoramari nka bamwe ba kera batazi gusoma no kwandika, Kagame yaratwigishije ku buryo tubasha kumenya aho tuva n’aho tujya.
Navuga ko nk’ibyangombwa by’ubutaka bimbaruyeho (UPI), bibarirwa muri za mirongo nubwo ntavuze umubare nyir’izina, imodoka na zo ikigo ntikibuze imodoka nka cumi na zingahe, niba mu rugo ufite iyo ugendamo. Umugore n’abana bikaba uko na byo biba ari iyo mitungo twavugaga.
Navuga ko n’iyo ntabivuga mu buryo bw’imibare ngo ni angahe ariko uramutse ufite izo UPI zirenga 40 muri Kigali, ukavuga ngo mfite imodoka z’ikigo zirenga 10, umuryango (umugore n’abana bakaba bafite imodoka) nawe ufite indi… umuntu yagereranya na we akirebera.
Ibyo byose ubwo byajya munsi ya miliyari 6 Frw?
Oya ntabwo byajya munsi. Aho mvuze ko byajya munsi naba mbeshye kuko hari na UPI imwe ubarira hamwe n’ibikorwa biyiriho ugasanga birarenga n’iyo miliyari.
Wanazamuka rwose ukaba wagera no muri miliyari 10 Frw ukabarira hafi aho.
Abantu ko bakomeza kuvuga ko i Kigali ubuzima burushaho guhenda, kuri mwebwe ibanga ryabaye irihe?
Nanjye ni uko mba mbibona burya kamere yacu ukuntu iteye; duhora dushaka. Njye ukubwira iyo mitungo yose yanditse kuri njye cyangwa ku kigo cyanjye, mba mvuga ngo sindagera mu rugendo rw’ubukire icyakora nkumva nararutangiye; mbese nko kuvuga ngo nateyemo ikirenge cya mbere.
Natangiye urugendo rero ariko sindagera ku bukire nifuza.
Umuntu rero iyo abyutse akabona ibihumbi 10 Frw ahita yumva ashaka ibihumbi 20 Frw akavuga ngo ubuzima burakomeye, ariko iyo turebye mu bipimo by’igihugu, tukareba imibereho y’Abanyarwanda, ubona ko yahindutse cyane kandi igahinduka neza.
Urebera ku kuntu abantu bakora bakiteza imbere, uko bihangira imirimo. Uko babayeho, ibikorwa hirya no hino mu ma restaurants n’utubari; uko abantu babyitabira.
Hari n’ibitari bihari rero nko mu 1994, 1995 ndetse n’iyo byari kuba bihari ntabwo byari kubona abakiliya.
Ikindi kikwereka ko u Rwanda ruri gutera imbere mu rwego rw’ubukungu, ni iyo usimbutse ukajya mu bihugu by’abaturanyi. Si ubukungu bwihariwe n’abantu bamwe, ahubwo burasaranganyijwe ku bantu bose, icyakora amahirwe nta wundi uzajya kuyagushakira, ukomba gushyiraho akawe.
Wumva uzibara nk’umukire ari uko ufite iki?
Umunsi nzaba mbarirwa muri miliyari z’amadolari, icyo gihe nzatangaza ko ndi umukire.
Uherutse gutangaza ko ubona ari wowe Munyarwanda wa mbere uzuzuza miliyari y’amadolari, ibyo bintu ubona bishoboka?
Birashoboka kandi nzabigeraho. Mu gihe hakorwaga Jenoside yakorewe Abatutsi, umuntu yabaga yambaye umwenda umwe. Niba rero naravuye ku mwenda umwe ntagira data, singire mama cyangwa abavandimwe bo kumfata ukuboko, uyu munsi nkaba ngenze aha, kubera iki se nakumva ko mu myaka 10 iri imbere iyo miliyari y’amadolari izaba idahari?
Umuntu akwiye guhora atekereza ko bishoboka. Tukagura imipaka mu ntekerezo tugashakisha amafaranga kandi ntekereza ko bizashoboka kandi nibwira ko nzabigeraho.
Ni amafaranga menshi bingana iki mwinjije mu kwezi kumwe?
Hari ukwezi nigeze kwinjiza hafi miliyari. Navuga ko uko kwezi kwari kwansekeye.
Iyo mutashye nimugoroba muri kureba ibyo mwakoreshejeho amafaranga yanyu mu buzima bwa buri munsi, mubona ari iki gitwara menshi?
Mba ngomba kubaho neza. Amafaranga abereyeho kuntunga ntabwo njyewe mbereyeho gutunga amafaranga. Nyashaka kugira ngo antunge, mbeho neza numbona uvuge uti dore Sadate, ntembere ahantu heza ku buryo umuryango wanjye utifuza kujya mu biruhuko ngo ubibure.
Hari ibintu bibiri numva amafaranga agomba kumfasha: Kumpa abantu, akampa no kubaho neza. Ni ibyo mba numva byancira ishati kurusha kuvuga ngo nzagira inzu, na za miliyoni nubwo na byo ari byiza kubigira.
Kugira amafaranga ntugire agakweto si byo. Abantu nk’abo banatuma amafaranga adahererekanywa ngo agere ku bandi.
Ikintu kintwara amafaranga cyane rero, ni ukwita ku muryango wanjye. Kujya hanze mu biruhuko. Iyo uhagurutse uri kumwe n’abantu icyenda mu kajya hanze y’u Rwanda, bitwara amafaranga menshi.
Iby’amashuri byo simbitinzeho kuko byo ni ibisanzwe. Amashuri ni wo murage mba numva ko abana bakwiye kwiga mu mashuri meza. Kwambara no gutura ahantu heza na byo biri mu bintwara amafaranga menshi kuko sinatura mu nzu mbi. Ntibyakunda ntabwo nakwiyima kuko n’ubundi twaje twambaye ubusa kandi tuzasubirayo ntacyo twambaye.
Ikindi kigendaho amafaranga ni ugutanga ubufasha. Idini yacu ya Islam muri Korowani, havuga ko gutanga bitagabanya umutungo ahubwo birawongera. Iryo ni ihame ry’abayisilamu nyakuri.
IGIHE: Mu byo kwambara ni iki mwaguze gihenze?
Ndumva ari inkweto y’amadolari 560 kuko ujya anyambika aba i Bruxelles. Icyakora mfite n’isaha ya Rolex ifite agaciro k’ibihumbi birenga 10 by’amadolari ya Amerika.
Ibijyanye n’imodoka byo bite?
Imodoka mfite ihenze abantu bashobora gutekereza ko ari iriya V8 ngendamo, ariko imodoka y’umugore wanjye ni yo ihenze. Benz C63 ishobora kuba ifite agaciro kari hejuru ya miliyoni 300 Frw igeze hano mu Rwanda.
Iyanjye yo ndumva itarengeje miliyoni 180-200 gutyo.
Mukomoje ku mugore wanyu, ndetse mukunze kumugarukaho cyane; ni umuntu mufata gute?
Ni umugore w’igitangaza. Uriya yankunze nta mafaranga mfite, nta bigango mfite ngo uvuge ngo ndi umugabo w’igitangaza, ntafite umuryango nibura ngo abe avuga ati ngiye mu muryango runaka ni byo ngiye kungukiramo. Ibyo byonyine biramusobanura.
Bavuga ko inyuma y’umugabo w’igihangange haba hari umugore w’igitangaza. Umuntu utararongora namugira inama yo kubikora kandi nkamusabira Imana ngo imuhe umugore mwiza uzamugira igihangange.
Uwanjye ndamushimira kuba yaranyemeye gutyo ndetse urwo rugendo rwose turacyari kumwe. Sinari kuba wa wundi mwahinganye imigende ngo ningera mu ndege musige, ninjya i Dubai musige kandi mu migende twarahambukanye tugacana mu buzima bugoye. Aho ndi hose iyo ntari kumwe na we mba numva hari icyo mbuze.
Ndi umuntu nshobora gukosa, ariko muha icyubahiro gikwiriye, nkamwubaha ndetse nkanamwubahisha kandi n’aho badutumira hose mu nzego zose bamaze kubimenya ko Sadate atajya asiga umugore we.
Nta kindi namwitura uretse kumubera umugabo mwiza.
Ibyerekeye ikibuga cya kajugujugu ufite aho utuye ni ukuri? Ese mwarayiguze cyangwa murabiteganya?
Mpereye ku nzu ntuyemo, ni inzu natangiye gutekereza mu 2005 cyangwa 2006 ndetse nahise mbibwira umugore ko ari yo nzu y’inzozi zanjye. Ubwo yari igizwe n’ibyo narotaga icyo gihe.
Aho gukorera siporo, aho gukorera sauna n’aha massage, aho kogera muri piscine, aho kuganirira hatandukanye, ingano y’ibyumba kugera hejuru ku gisenge cyayo aho numvaga igomba kujya igwaho na kajugujugu.
Icyo gihe numvaga ngomba kuzaba Umunyarwanda wa mbere utunze helicopter ye nk’umunyarwanda atari ikigo runaka.
Icyo kibuga cya Helicopter ku nzu yanjye kiriho kandi na yo mba numva yakagombye kuza. Icyakora ubu inzozi zatangiye guhinduka nkavuga nti ese ubundi kuki itaba “Private jet”? Niba Dangoté cyangwa undi muherwe abyuka agafata indege ye, kuki twebwe Abanyarwanda tutatekereza mu buryo bwagutse ko natwe ibyo nta mupaka tubifiteho. Tugomba kubaho kuko twigeze kubaho nta buzima dufite.
Wibona he ukanabona he u Rwanda mu myaka 10 iri imbere?
Nibona nk’umuherwe mu myaka 10 iri imbere. U Rwanda tuzaba turi mu bihugu bitanga icyizere cy’ubukire bufatika.
